Building Trust and Safety: What to Look for in a Disability-Affirming Therapist
In episode 78 of The Chronic Illness Therapists Podcast, Samantha Allweiss, LCSW, and Niki Colon, LCSW, discuss the intersection of mental health, chronic illness, and trauma and the importance of finding a therapist that honors your physical and mental experience. Together, they explore how moving beyond traditional talk therapy to embrace the mind-body connection can create new pathways for healing.
The Limitations of Traditional Talk Therapy
Many mainstream therapeutic approaches focus primarily on changing your thoughts to become happier. While this approach can be helpful, it often overlooks a crucial aspect of healing: the body.
Many clients with chronic illness or trauma may struggle to articulate their experiences verbally. Instead, they intellectualize their feelings - staying in their heads as a way to create distance from emotional pain because their bodies don’t feel safe.
This disconnection can lead to compensatory behaviors, including substance use, as individuals search for ways to manage their distress.
The Power of the Mind-Body Connection
Samantha and Niki emphasize the mind-body connection, recognizing that emotions aren't just mental experiences but are deeply stored within our physical bodies.
Through mindfulness practices, clients learn to reconnect with their bodily sensations, gradually building a bridge between their mental and physical experiences. This reconnection becomes the most important step in the healing process.
The Science Behind Somatic Approaches
A 2021 study in the European Journal of Psychotraumatology found that body-oriented interventions appeared to reduce PTSD symptoms may help reduce PTSD symptoms.
While more rigorous research is still needed to evaluate effectiveness, approaches like Allweiss's use of Hanna Somatics and Colon's integration of mindfulness and movement exercises show promising impact.
Destiny’s Note: If you’re trying to figure out which therapy is best for you, just know that the research - while important - isn’t nearly as important as how YOU relate to the therapeutic approach.
For example, there is endless research on the efficacy of EMDR, but I personally did not find it to meet my own needs. Therapy really depends on you, your preferences, and your therapist’s ability to see you with true accuracy and unconditional positive regard (essentially acceptance and non-judgment).
Understanding Chronic Pain and Illness
Chronic pain and trauma are deeply connected and personal.
Pain may begin with an injury, but the brain can continue sending protective pain signals long after initial healing. Past trauma can make the nervous system more reactive and heighten pain sensitivity, while chronic pain itself can be traumatic - especially when medical concerns are dismissed.
Both deserve validation.
More providers now recognize the mind-body connection, offering treatments that acknowledge how physical and emotional pain intertwine, such as gentle movement practices.
A disability-affirming therapist acknowledges that pain is real - both physically and emotionally. These experiences are interconnected and deserve respectful exploration.
Anyone who suggests it's "all in your head" is missing the bigger picture.
Remember, you are the expert on your body, and any healing journey should start with that fundamental truth. Therapists can guide and support you, but your healing journey is yours to decide.
The Power of Group Therapy: Finding Community and Healing
There's something uniquely powerful about being in a room (virtual or physical) with people who really get it.
Group therapy offers something different from one-on-one sessions - a chance to see you're not alone in your experiences. When someone shares about that doctor who dismissed their symptoms or how their family doesn't understand why they can't "just push through," the nodding heads around the room say more than words ever could.
What's particularly special is watching the transformation as people realize they're not "too sensitive" or "making things up." In a group, you might hear someone describe exactly what you've been feeling but couldn't put into words, or you might be the one helping others by sharing your story.
Many participants say things like, "This is the first time I've felt truly understood.” That kind of connection can be healing in itself.
Niki's group can help you find your community. Whether you’re newly diagnosed or have been navigating chronic illness for years, connecting with others who truly understand can be a powerful step in your healing journey.
Body-Based Practices in Action
Samantha and Niki both incorporate evidence-informed body-based practices into their work. Here's how these approaches manifest in practice:
Hanna Somatics: Through gentle, mindful movements, clients learn to release chronic muscle tension. A typical session might begin with the client seated comfortably, practicing small, controlled movements of the spine to increase awareness of habitual holding patterns. Allweiss has adapted these exercises for various mobility levels, making them accessible to clients with different physical capabilities.
Mindfulness Integration: Colon's approach combines traditional mindfulness techniques with gentle movement. Sessions often begin with guided breathing exercises, gradually incorporating small hand movements or gentle stretches as clients become more comfortable in their bodies. This integration helps clients develop a more nuanced awareness of their physical and emotional states.
These practices work by helping your nervous system feel safer in your body.
When you're dealing with chronic pain or illness, your body often stays in a protective state, as if it is constantly on guard. Through these gentle movements and mindfulness practices, change is not forced, and your nervous system is provided a chance to relax.
Disability-Affirming Therapy: Naming and Validating Systems of Oppression
A crucial aspect of this work involves naming and validating clients' experiences, particularly around medical trauma.
This becomes especially important for individuals with intersecting marginalized identities. By explicitly acknowledging systems of oppression such as ableism and fatphobia, therapists help clients understand that their struggles are not personal failings but linked to systemic injustice.
In therapy, naming these experiences directly is important because understanding the broader context matters.
Your struggles aren't just individual challenges - they're often responses to broken systems.
Maybe you've been told, "You’re just anxious or depressed" or "You just need to lose weight" when seeking care. These experiences compound over time, creating layers of trauma that deserve acknowledgment. When we name these experiences in therapy, we're not just validating your reality - we're challenging the internalized shame that often comes from being repeatedly dismissed.
What To Expect From Disability-Affirming Therapy
Good therapy starts with clarity.
Your therapist should be upfront about their practices, including how they handle accessibility, COVID precautions, and scheduling. Many therapists will also share personal backgrounds and how they shape their approach to treatment. This transparency helps you make informed choices about your care while maintaining healthy therapeutic boundaries.
Understanding the therapeutic relationship is crucial.
Your therapist is a supporter and guide, not an authority figure who knows your body better than you do. They should be clear about their role: to offer tools, perspectives, and support while respecting your autonomy in making decisions about your health and life. This includes being honest about their areas of expertise and limitations.
Grief, Radical Acceptance, and Growth with Chronic Illness
Getting diagnosed with a chronic illness often means grieving who you used to be.
This grief isn't linear - it comes in waves, and that's completely normal. While therapy can help you make meaning of these experiences, the goal is not to be pushed toward simply “acceptance.” This journey takes time, and you deserve gentle support along the way.
Your relationship with your changing body and abilities might shift daily. Some days, you might feel at peace; others, you might feel frustrated or angry.
Both reactions are valid.
Radical acceptance doesn't mean loving every aspect of your condition; it means acknowledging your reality without judgment while still allowing space for hope, adaptation, and growth on your own terms.
How to Find the Right Therapist
A good fit might not happen immediately, and that's normal. When looking for a therapist who understands chronic illness and trauma, consider asking:
How do you work with medical trauma and disability?
What's your approach to disability justice?
What are your COVID-19 safety practices?
How do you support clients with multiple marginalized identities?
Pay attention to how you feel during and after sessions. Consider:
Does your therapist respond thoughtfully to your concerns?
Do they demonstrate an understanding of chronic illness beyond just sympathy?
Do they respect your boundaries and expertise about your own body?
These questions can help guide your search.
Trust your gut. If you consistently feel worse after sessions, it's okay to explore other options.
Resources for Your Healing Journey
In podcast episode 78, we discuss helpful resources for those managing chronic illness and trauma.
"Spoonies Unite" support groups (led by Niki Colon): Weekly online meetings focused on chronic illness management
Chronic Illness Therapist Directory: Database of specialized therapists
"The Invisible Kingdom" by Megan O'Rourke: Deep exploration of chronic illness experiences
Works by Andrea Gibson: Poetry addressing chronic illness and disability
"Care Work: Dreaming Disability Justice": Essential reading on disability rights
Moving Forward: The Future of Holistic Healing
The integration of body-based practices with traditional therapy represents a promising frontier in mental health care, particularly for those managing chronic illness and trauma.
While research continues to explore these approaches' effectiveness, the experiences of practitioners like Allweiss and Colon suggest that addressing both mind and body creates new possibilities for healing.
For those considering this approach, remember that healing is deeply personal. Take time to find a therapist who understands your unique needs, respects your experiences, and offers a truly holistic approach to well-being.
Whether through individual therapy, group support, or a combination of approaches, the journey toward healing begins with acknowledging the profound connection between our physical and emotional selves.
Want to listen to the podcast interview? Click here for Episode 78: Building Trust and Safety: What to Look for in a Disability-Affirming Therapist.
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Episode transcribed with AI and will contain errors that are not representative of the actual word or meaning of the sentence.
Samantha Allweiss LCSW: [00:00:00] A lot of when we intellectualize what we tend to learn when folks tend to take on is it's not safe to feel these things in my body, right? I have to distance it. So part of the role of therapy too is providing a space where folks can experience those emotions and realize that they're not dangerous that they can tolerate them.
And then also the body stops having to engage in these compensatory strategies and like these compensatory behaviors try to distance from the emotion like substance use other forms of numbing from.
I recorded this episode in September of 2024, and I think this week is a perfect time to air this episode, given that we are talking a lot about the intersectional identities of living with chronic pain and chronic illness, and also
what it's like to be [00:01:00] isolated in this society due to other marginalized identities. Specifically in this episode, we're talking about LGBTQ.
We might be silenced in government websites, and government institutions, and schools, and all of that, but we won't be silenced here,
And I hope that this episode brings you a sense of normalcy and peace amidst really difficult times.
The Chronic Illness Therapist podcast is meant to be a place where people with chronic illnesses can come to feel heard, seen, and safe while listening to mental health therapists and other medical professionals talk about the realities of treating difficult conditions. This might be a new concept for you, one in which you never have to worry about someone inferring that it's all in your head.
We dive deep into the human side of treating complex medical conditions and help you find professionals that leave you feeling hopeful for the future. I hope you love what you learned here and please consider leaving a review or sharing this podcast with someone you love. This podcast is meant for educational purposes only.
For specific questions related to your unique circumstances, please contact a licensed medical professional in your state of [00:02:00] residence.
Samantha Allweiss LCSW: Hi, everyone. I'm really happy to be here. My name is Samantha. Always. My pronouns are she, her. I'm a licensed clinical social worker and the director of social responsibility and inclusion at room to breathe psychotherapy and yoga.
which is a psychotherapy practice integrated with the yoga studio, really focusing on the mind body connection and somatic awareness. Uh, before I worked at Room to Breathe as a clinician and supervisor, uh, I worked in refugee resettlement. In a community mental health practice, and that's where I became really interested in [00:03:00] body awareness and alternative therapeutic modalities, aside from talk therapy.
That's actually how I found room to breathe. I took our yoga teacher training because I was really interested in strengthening my body. Nonverbal processing through trauma and that is how I heard that there was a private practice and long story short, I ended up here.
Destiny Davis LPC CRC: Amazing. Were you a therapist first, a mental health therapist first, or did that yoga journey bring you into, um, being a therapist?
Samantha Allweiss LCSW: Yeah, really good question. I was a mental health therapist. First, I found yoga for myself as a form of stress management. And then through my work, which is primarily with interpreters working with non Western populations, I started to think a lot, um, Especially for survivors of trauma who disproportionately experience chronic illness and chronic pain and [00:04:00] impact on the body.
How do we speak to the body and work with the body instead of just working with the mind? Both is really important, and when you're working with interpreters, ways around language and the limitations of cross cultural dialogue became really important to me. So that's how I found the teacher training.
Destiny Davis LPC CRC: Amazing, thank you. Nikki, I'd love to hear, yeah, your introduction and, um, yeah.
Niki Colon, LSW: Yeah, my name is Nikki Cologne. I'm a licensed social worker also at Room to Breathe Psychotherapy and Yoga. My pronouns are she, they. Um, and yeah, my work centers marginalized identities, specifically chronically ill, disabled folks, but also queer, trans and gender non conforming, uh, poly and kinky folks.
And. The intersections of all of the above. Um, I too am really passionate about the mind body connection. Before I was a therapist, I was actually a body [00:05:00] worker and a clinical massage therapist. So, I had a similar journey finding room to breathe as Samantha. Just really specifically looking for places that centered my body connection.
Um, Prioritize somatic work, uh, so I could have a place to incorporate a more embodied approach into my therapeutic practice. Just that's what feels most authentic to me.
Destiny Davis LPC CRC: I massage therapy fascinates me so much. Um, just like working with the body in that way and yoga, of course, to like being able to move your body in different ways.
But, um, I would love to hear from you both. Tell me a little bit about the physical work, especially if so in our society, we separate the two and we know that they're not separate, but we do talk about it separately.
Can you talk to me as if you are not separating the two? Tell me what this work looks like. Um, And it's okay if you do separate it because [00:06:00] our language just brings us there, but then how does it look to, you know, massage therapy? Can you tell me about, like, what you learned in that, that, that helps you through your work clinically now?
Um, I'm really not phrasing this question really well. I feel like there's a, there's like an artful answer here that I just feel like we would be able to draw better than say, but Um, do you guys have any thoughts or ideas from what I'm asking or should I continue to clarify
Niki Colon, LSW: you think that are coming up?
I think back to like, so for example, when I was a massage therapist, I actually would incorporate like bits of mindful practice, especially when I was doing, um. More nurturing, like, connective work, like, uh, prenatal, for example, I would incorporate a lot of, like, with consent, I would get permission to, , place hands on belly, and, like, lead through sort of a meditation that would, [00:07:00] would connect, like, mom to baby, things like that, um, that is just always felt authentic to my work, and so I think similarly, um, In the therapy space, , I bring in a lot of, like, , act, emotion, exposure, and so, you know, when people are really, , deep in their cognitions, , really running through with, , what's going on in the mind, , I, I pause people a lot to ask, like, okay, what is showing up in your body right now while you share that with me?
, what are we noticing? What are the sensations? What are you feeling? Um, just to, bridge that gap, that perceived gap. Obviously there's no gap, but that perceived gap, this, this perceived duality, bringing it back into focus.
Destiny Davis LPC CRC: Yeah.
Samantha Allweiss LCSW: Yeah, the work I've done with folks who have chronic pain.
I was actually just talking with Nikki about this. I ran a chronic pain support group. [00:08:00] And one of the things that's really tricky about chronic pain. is that it often originates from an injury, right? That's where the pain first starts, but then when it becomes chronic, it often isn't because you're doing any harm to that part of the body or that that injury is getting exacerbated.
But it is a signal from the brain. You get kind of like a trauma response where the brain and body are working together to try to protect that part of the body. And a lot of people do a lot of physical therapy to try to address it. They're going doctor to doctor. And so it's one of these really tricky conversations because we do this separation of telling people that it does likely originate neurologically.
It still manifests in these pain receptors between brain and body. But what I get a lot from people is this is all in your brain. You're telling me this is all in my [00:09:00] mind. You're telling me that I'm crazy, that I'm losing it. And so having a really nuanced conversation. And Nikki and I were talking about the value of group work for folks who experience chronic pain and chronic illness, which we'll definitely talk about in fostering community, but also and be able to talk through some of the automatic responses that can come up.
And I have a couple of folks who are experiencing chronic pain, who are now doing the work of actually like getting to the origin of the pain. Through rewiring these neural pathways, we're experiencing so much more freedom, but it can be a really tricky conversation because of the separation that you're talking about destiny.
Destiny Davis LPC CRC: I love all that. Thank you so much. Yes. And can you, either of you, answer why it's so hard to explore these issues cognitively? Why do we, what, what is moving us into semantics? What does make the body work so [00:10:00] powerful? But can we, can we talk a little bit about why it's so First, like why it's so hard to work with it just cognitively, the way that our traditional therapy has been.
Niki Colon, LSW: I don't know if this is an official answer, but something that I I talk a lot about with my clients is that like, no one is out here teaching us how to feel. It's not like we're being taught in emotional vocabulary in school. It's not like they're teaching us emotional literacy or like how to communicate emotions to each other.
And I mean, I can't speak for everyone, but that seems to be a really common struggle at least in my practice for like people often just don't have even like a basic emotional vocabulary. To explain and of course, if we don't have the words to explain how we're feeling like, you know, obviously that's that's really difficult to convey how we're feeling if we don't [00:11:00] understand the difference between anxiety and excitement, like they feel really similarly in the body.
Um, I think there's a reason why movies like Inside Out are so popular because like that is giving kids a framework. I haven't even seen Inside Out, by the way, but I hear people talking about it a lot that like. It is actually giving a framework to kids, and, you know, despite that we would all be better off for it, right, if we were being taught these things in school, we're just not.
Um, so I, I get the sense that it's like a broader, , societal feeling.
Samantha Allweiss LCSW: Yeah, yeah, it's such a good point, Nikki. I also think because Nikki and I really center our work and working with folks with chronic illness and specifically within like other folks in the queer community, there's also something about being socialized out of safety with your body.
Safety around sex and sexuality, gender identity, [00:12:00] ways in which our connection to our body and I talk about this a lot with folks gets disrupted through trauma, and this could be structural issues. This can be direct family trauma. Right. And so, building that connection becomes the way of building relationship with all of you.
And. we tend to the folks that tend to track into therapy tend to be verbal processors and intellectualizers. So they love to live up here. And I think part of the reason why we tend to go that way is because we want to make sense of it first. But if we just make sense of it, but we don't feel that the impact of what that means, then we're just kind of sitting in this place where we're fully disconnected from the part, from a huge part of us, right?
Our bodies felt the trauma too. And so it's like, I always say the way out is [00:13:00] in and in includes the body too, not just the thoughts we have about what happened to us.
Destiny Davis LPC CRC: It's so interesting how we really are, like, we're in very intellectualized society. It's all cognitive. We do all live above the neck, but yet we do have such a, um, limited vocabulary.
Like you said, Nikki, it's, it's so, I don't know, I've just never thought about that before. I
Niki Colon, LSW: use the feelings wheel a lot. It's like a running joke with so many of my clients like, Oh, Oh, I said, good. I said, fine, the wheels come in. Cause I don't know how I'm feeling. And I'm like, yeah, yeah. But this beautiful thing happens over time that like the wheel needs to come out less and less, right?
Like we, we can learn this stuff.
Destiny Davis LPC CRC: Yeah. Yeah.
Samantha Allweiss LCSW: Sorry. One other thing too, to add is A lot of when we intellectualize [00:14:00] what we tend to learn when folks tend to take on is it's not safe to feel these things in my body, right? I have to distance it. So part of the role of therapy too is providing a space where folks can experience those emotions and realize that they're not dangerous that they can tolerate them.
And then also the body stops having to engage in these compensatory strategies and like these compensatory behaviors try to distance from the emotion like substance use other forms of numbing from. And that's so profound that I work with folks who regularly engage in substance use and as they develop awareness and capacity to sit in their emotions.
They just naturally turn to it less and less. It's not everyone. Like this isn't a universal, but I think like that communicates that safety piece and that we have to feel safe within also to feel safe [00:15:00] outside of ourselves.
Destiny Davis LPC CRC: Yeah, that absolutely. I find that too. Cause substances numb the physical sensations.
Right. And so if we, if we learned that we can tolerate them, then we don't have to numb them anymore. Yeah,
Samantha Allweiss LCSW: exactly.
Destiny Davis LPC CRC: Good. Um, I love this. So we, you guys started to talk a little bit about value of group work, um, fostering community and like why they're so powerful and and what someone can learn in group that maybe they can't or is hard to learn in individual therapy.
Niki Colon, LSW: Yeah, I think the shared experience piece, well okay I'm making an assumption here because I'm a chronically ill disabled group facilitator. I realize not everyone who facilitates a group. would be shared experience. So I can only speak to my experience, but running the groups has [00:16:00] just like deepened this understanding of how powerful shared experience is.
Um, I think, you know, both as someone who lives with chronic illness myself, but, but also for. My group members. Um, it's just a different kind of connection. I think that can only come from like truly understanding what it's like and as chronically ill folks who just have this experience. Yeah. pervasive pattern of invalidation from, sadly, medical providers, right?
Um, if you don't have a lot of peers in your life who are also chronically ill, it can feel like you're out on an island and you can be in therapy. You can even be in therapy with a chronically ill therapist, but I still think one on one is just different from being in a room with like 8, 9, 10, 11 other people who are sharing [00:17:00] similar anecdotes and similar traumas and similar experiences of dismissal and disregard.
And it's just like, it's a really beautiful thing when we can even get to the point where we can laugh about it because obviously it's a horrible thing. It's horrible, but it's not surprising, but the beauty and the healing is that when you're in a room with 10 other people for whom this is also happening, it's like, well, we can laugh about it.
We're all in this together. Um, so yeah, I, I've just found it to be, I feel like the groups instill hope in a really different way. And I don't mean that to sound like we can't instill hope as individual therapists, but what I witness in the groups. It's magical. Like, it's my favorite, I run two, so it's my favorite two 75 minute blocks of time each week because it's just, it's just magical to watch, [00:18:00] to watch people feel seen and understood and like, wow, this is happening to you too.
This isn't just me. It's, it's just magical. It's just different. And it's so much
Destiny Davis LPC CRC: easier to see that when you're like, you, you see it with your own eyes, you feel it in the room. Whereas with one on one it's like your therapist can tell you, I can even share my own stuff with you to, to help you understand that you're not alone, but it's still so different than when a group of your peers are sharing the same thing.
And then through that, you realize so many things you're not crazy. You're not making it up. You're not like. Just because the people over here don't understand doesn't mean nobody understands you. Yeah.
Samantha Allweiss LCSW: Yeah, I would also add the ideating and problem solving that folks engage in in space together. Um, when I ran my group for folks [00:19:00] experiencing chronic pain, people would come with challenges that they were facing in the medical realm and we would work together.
And it got to a point where really I was sitting back and folks were taking the lead and supporting one another, not just in validating. In the validating of their experience, but also in thinking about how do you self advocate? What is the role? When do you know when it's important to find a new provider?
And the ideas that folks had were also so rich. for me, it's something I hadn't thought of in my own journey. And so I also just think you have so much more of an expansive body of knowledge for folks who are doing this work. There isn't a playbook, right? There's no one way to be chronically ill. There's no one way to experience chronic pain.
And there's no one experience that you're going to have in the medical system. But we do know these [00:20:00] things tend to happen that you experience Some form of medical gaslighting that you could experience burnout around the difficulty of navigating the system and having people who can just not just listen, but problem solve from a perspective of having experienced that that's just like a richness like I've never seen.
Destiny Davis LPC CRC: That's so true. Oh, yes. I, yeah, I completely agree. Um, do y'all do body based work in groups or does it tend to be a lot more of the talking only because it, that, that is so powerful with the resonating and hearing that other people have the same experiences?
Samantha Allweiss LCSW: Yeah, I became really interested in how to adapt or utilize Hannah somatics, which is um, it's really, it's focused on movement patterns that folks engage in when they experience chronic pain, um, that are like holding patterns [00:21:00] or trauma in their body. And it's kind of leaning into those movement patterns and then releasing them.
Typically has how I'd experienced it was always on a yoga mat on the ground, but I wanted to be really thoughtful because a lot of my folks were experiencing pretty significant back pain and talked about actually feeling more comfortable being seated than having to get all the way down on the ground.
And so I focused a lot on how do I incorporate or utilize these movement practices and adapt it for the chair, which was a great. Uh, practice for me professionally, and I would engage in that for about 15, 20 minutes at the end of every group session. And folks had the, you know, the great thing about somatics is it is really gentle and you actually can just visualize it to be doing the practice.
So there's no need to have to do every movement to feel the benefits of it. Um, yeah, and it was, it was [00:22:00] really, really helpful for some folks.
Destiny Davis LPC CRC: What are some of the benefits you've noticed that are, that have been like almost instantaneous versus maybe benefits that were like after like, like a few sessions or days, weeks, months after someone has done this work?
Samantha Allweiss LCSW: Yeah, it's a really good question. I would say the instantaneous piece oftentimes was that they noticed a part of their body that they hadn't been paying attention to before. A lot of the work with chronic pain from my experience or my perspective is also helping folks notice other parts of their body because the brain actually like changes when we experience chronic pain and that part if you have someone map out the parts of their body they'll actually map out that part as disproportionately larger.
Because of the impact that it has on the brain and honestly, our consciousness and our awareness. So just [00:23:00] noticing different parts of the body. And then I would say over time, it's really developing the capacity to notice where they're holding and where the release is happening and maybe where they're compensating in their movement patterns and giving them then the power to correct.
And maybe like see where the source of their chronic pain might be coming from those unconscious holding patterns as a result of physical or emotional trauma.
Destiny Davis LPC CRC: Yeah. When you mentioned going, I can't remember how you said it exactly, but going into the pain, was that, is that right?
Samantha Allweiss LCSW: Yeah. In some ways it's getting to the, going in and getting to the source of the pain instead of trying to avoid the pain too.
Yeah.
Destiny Davis LPC CRC: Um, it also reminded me a little bit of progressive muscle relaxation, the way that you described, like, leaning in and then, and then you can let go.
Can you speak a little bit more to like this whole mechanism? [00:24:00]
Samantha Allweiss LCSW: Sure. Yeah. Um, it's kind of the idea that there are specific movement patterns and I don't want to misspeak. It's been a while since I've looked at the more official texts, but that we tend to engage in these protective patterns. really simplified.
It's kind of curling in as a protective stance, then leaning to one side or the other, or kind of having a hyper extension in the back. So it's focused on these very specific movement patterns in the body, but there's a similarity to progressive muscle relaxation, certainly, and that it's bringing attention to the parts that you're holding by actually emphasizing that movement.
Hannah somatics just has very specific movement patterns that they utilize based on that information or that body of knowledge.
Destiny Davis LPC CRC: That makes perfect sense. Nikki, what's coming up for you around some of this?
Niki Colon, LSW: Um, I, I'm just so [00:25:00] fascinated. We have a class actually at room to breathe that is, is this style of somatics that regrettably I've not taken a little while, but I used to make sure to take it every week.
And it's just, I don't know, it's just really profound. So I, I just. really appreciate that Samantha was able to incorporate that in, you know, a shorter format in the space. Um, the way that I'm in, I'm approaching it is obviously a little bit different again, cause I'm not a certified yoga instructor, but Um, you know, I will sort of pair my exercises that day based on like whatever the topic is, so let's say our topic is internalized ableism or medical gaslighting.
I might start out the mindfulness component where I prompt folks to think about a specific time. Where, you know, they experience medical gaslighting, um, deliberately prompting some of those [00:26:00] feelings that came up, um, to practice distress tolerance, to practice sitting with these emotions, but then incorporating the movement to find a different way to sort of process.
what's showing up. Um, and everything I offer is just a suggestion, you know, I'll, I'll offer like a series of things. I'll always make it really clear that if what the body is craving is stillness to honor that, that that is okay. I do always make sure to say what Samantha already shared about, like, just visualizing it is enough.
So like, if you do want to take stillness, you can, you can imagine the prompts that I'm giving. Um, but yeah, really trying to emphasize that, like, We store these emotions in our body and we, we can move through them. Um, and yeah, I, similarly, I devote 15 to 20 minutes each group, but I usually start the group with the exercise where Samantha would end.
Destiny Davis LPC CRC: The other thing that's coming up for me, as [00:27:00] you both are explaining this process, is that I don't know the exact number, but, um, It's like something like 80 or 90 percent of the thoughts that we have per day are repetitive. And I imagine a lot of our body movements are too. I know mine are. Um, and so that sounds like this is really a lot of practicing, moving differently, bringing attention.
You have to know what you're doing on repeat before you can change it. Um, Maybe not cognitively, but even somatically like leaning into this, you might realize, wait, yeah, I do hold myself this way. And then learning to how to change that with compassion. Compassion, I'm sure is at the heart of y'all's work too.
Um, people are so confused as to why that's so important, but if you're trying to change something, but you're like, Oh, you messed up again. Oh, you did it again. Oh, like then it, it really just puts on our defense patterns again. .
Samantha Allweiss LCSW: Yeah, [00:28:00] absolutely. I was thinking about the connection with what we had talked about a little bit earlier of the way that we start to fear our emotions or socialized out of. This is what I tend to say, socialized out of connection to our emotions or to certain emotions. We start to fear the pain and believe that we cannot tolerate it.
And that tends to be reinforced when we try to engage in different movement patterns to avoid the pain. Right? And so part of it is also learning that your body is not in danger, that yes, these are signals, but it's not signaling that you're hurting anything or harming anything. It's, um, uh, leftover essentially, ostensibly, From a prior injury and your brain is trying to protect you and your body is trying to protect you.
And that's one thing I love to talk about [00:29:00] is how adaptive and how supportive these responses are and what we can do when they're no longer serving us in the space that we are now. But understanding why they came to be in the first place is also part of that self compassion, self acceptance. Nikki, is there anything you want to add to this?
Niki Colon, LSW: Yeah, I'm thinking too about how, we have to have internal awareness if we want to have any sense of like pacing and allocating our spoons. And, you know, this is something we talk a lot about in my group or like a lot of folks are coming to the space. often dissociating, right? Like being deliberately disconnected from the body because they don't want to feel the pain because they don't want to think about the illness.
And so these questions do often come up around like, well, why? Like this mindfulness exercise is not pleasant because if anything, I'm just more aware of the pain that I was not aware of before. And I'm like, yes, that's [00:30:00] true. There, there is often this, this misconception around mindfulness that it's like this.
pleasant zen like, like, relaxing experience, but we're really trying to strengthen interoception in here. And the reason we're trying to do that is because if, if you have an internal awareness, you're gonna be able to, to listen to your body's cues for pacing. You're going to be able to have a better understanding of like, if you only have one spoon left and it's like three o'clock and you've got a lot more day to go, you know?
Um, and. You know, practicing tolerating distress, like we all can handle so much more than we give ourselves credit for. Um, so yeah, I think some psychoeducation even just around like what mindfulness even is. What, what the point of all of this movement and this mindfulness even is, because it's not necessarily for relaxation.
It can be a beautiful byproduct of it, but like. [00:31:00] Yeah, like, really getting people on board with this idea that we're going to spend 15 to 20 minutes doing something that you might actually hate. But, you know, 10 weeks in, 12 weeks in, 16 weeks in, I do start to get some feedback around like, okay, I'm understanding.
Destiny Davis LPC CRC: Yeah, there's such a fight, a fight, because The body already knows. I think that it is going to be uncomfortable. And again, it's just trying to protect you. So it's, it puts up that fight so quickly and so strongly, but that's where the therapeutic relationship is so important. Cause if they trust us, then we can work in and trust is, I mean, trust is built in so many different ways.
It's not just our own like, Oh, we have the same lived experience or we are a therapist. So therefore you trust us. It's like, no, it's, do you feel heard? Do you feel seen? Do you feel validated and also like, uh, appropriately challenged? Because also [00:32:00] nobody, nobody, even if they think they do, nobody really likes to just be like, this, like, yes, everything you say is completely right.
We like challenge. We like. To have thoughtful, like engaging conversation. And so, um, yeah, I think that that's all of that is important. We're when we're trying to build trust with clients, when clients are trying to, when listeners, like when you're trying to figure out, do you, do I trust my therapist? Like, yes, I trust them to not do harm, you know, but do I trust them to like, be able to hold this space with me?
I think those are some of the things that come up for me. Is there anything else that comes up for you?
Samantha Allweiss LCSW: Yeah, I think you bring up a really important point that Nikki and I have spent a lot of time talking about. Um, and we were thinking about preparing for the podcast today. We were thinking about what is it that We would want prospective clients to know when they're looking for a therapist and [00:33:00] also what would we want therapists to know when they're thinking about working with someone who is chronically ill and who has intersectional identities, right?
Who is chronically ill and in a fat body, who is chronically ill and queer. Right, and I think one of the things that Nikki and I talk a lot about is components of informed consents, and I'm sure Nikki can elaborate on this really well, but it's having really purposeful conversations and really honest conversations for someone who is a chronically ill clinician.
I always encourage them to have open conversations about their own limitations in part. So it gives us permission when we need to care for ourselves to step away, to be human and to take care of ourselves. And also from my perspective, it gives the clients per. The ability to opt into working with someone who's chronically ill, because it means that there will be times [00:34:00] for me where I will be in the hospital and I won't be able to attend sessions and that can happen when I have flare ups really quickly.
And if folks want or feel like they need a therapist who's always on call. That's not going to be me. I always say. my health is the most important thing because I cannot do this work if I do not have it. And so that's always going to be the thing that takes precedence for me. And on the other side, I think it's really important for clinicians to be having conversations with folks.
intentionally about what accommodations would they benefit from? And so if you're doing in person work, this needs to look like COVID precautions, what COVID precautions are folks taking, and also what accommodations you have, what accessibility is there to get into your building? What accommodations do you have for virtual spaces?
How accessible is your virtual world? We found certain [00:35:00] platforms to be more accessible for folks versus Less. And I would argue that this should be conversation that the therapist is starting off, that the therapist is initiating. And this can also be conversation that the client starts off if the clinician is not taking the lead, just to make sure that they're going to have any level of safety in this space.
I'll pause, Nikki, I'm sure you have some stuff to add.
Niki Colon, LSW: Yeah, I was trying to even think about where to start because everything that you put out was, uh, maybe I'll speak to the informed consent piece first. Yeah, and I think Samantha and I have worked together a lot to like, really hone in, like, on how we are both doing this.
And we talk about it in our group supervision as well, such that like, even when we're not talking about disability, it's become a conversation around like, Oh, wow. There are so many things that I could be naming and for an informed consent to make sure that like people really understand what they're agreeing to, um, [00:36:00] even outside of a disability context.
But, yeah, I mean just adding on to what Samantha has already shared because I share similar things but, you know, I mean to, um. You know, some of the realities of working with a disabled clinician like there may be days where, you know, I come into the space flaring, like, maybe it's not so bad I need to take the day off.
But it might be a high pain day. I might be hooked up to my tens unit. I might have an ice pack. I might need to periodically pause my camera because like today I have a this bulge flare up and I sittings hard and I need to stand. Um, I name like there may be days that I can show up cognitively, but I'm having a migraine flare up or a vertical flare up and I might need to be off camera, and if I can, I'll always offer a rescheduling option if it's available, if that feels disruptive, and maybe this is because of [00:37:00] the population that I work with, so many of them are also chronically ill, but this is just not something anyone is ever upset about.
They're like, oh, if we have an off camera session, I can go for a walk, or like, I could meet you from my bed. That sounds great. Um, but yeah, so I do let people know these things ahead of time. I let them know, like, hey, I have Connective tissue issues. So I type notes. So, you know, I want to be really explicit that if you see me typing jotting down some notes, I'm not emailing.
I'm not chatting on the side and, you know, G chat, nothing like that. So yeah, I just, I really take the time to name these things. And then after naming these aspects of identity, you know, I make sure to say like, do you have any thoughts or concerns that might impact us working together? Or our therapeutic relationship.
Are there aspects of my disabled identity that pose a barrier to us working together? And that way people have the option to opt out [00:38:00] if it doesn't work for them. There's no surprises. So
Destiny Davis LPC CRC: I think what we're speaking to, like the biggest theme, really in everything we've talked about so far, is around naming it.
And when you name something, it just gives it this like It gives it breath. It gives it freedom. It gives it, it gives choice and choice is one of the things that help us feel regulated that help us feel at ease is having choice. And so even with, you know, going back to like pain and naming body sensations or moving our body and in a safe environment where if you, if you have pain during this movement in a yoga session with a, with a qualified, you know, professional with your therapist, um, you can actually express that pain.
It isn't go do this yoga class and like get through it and don't express the pain, [00:39:00] the whole, and then to express it and be validated and be seen, not just like, oh, you're always complaining. Like, yeah, I, , I, you know, I, what do you mean? Like, honestly, I complain all the time and like, it doesn't do any good.
And I'm like, that's not, we're not one that's fine. And two, like. I'm not saying to just come to therapy and we're going to complain. Like it's about venting and getting validation in that and being seen accurately. Um, so that's, that's a lot of what my work will look like.
Samantha Allweiss LCSW: Yeah, absolutely. I also think, you know, this is why we both like to talk about systems of oppression that impact folks like naming the pathology of the system that often gets localized and create and and and so socially constructed as the pathology of the individual.
And so I'm very explicit [00:40:00] about naming ableism. The ways that internalized ableism can show up, naming how fat phobia can show up, how it's so deeply rooted in racism. And I talk about this with my light clients a lot because I like to talk with them about proximity to power and how thinness got equated with power and status and social symbol in part because it is equated with white bodies.
It is normed around white bodies and it's a really interesting conversation when you start to have folks just like poke some holes in this, these systems that they've so deeply internalized within themselves. And I think like that piece of. of zooming out to then localize it back into a specific individual's experience is really, really powerful, too.
I know Nikki does that work a lot as well.
Niki Colon, LSW: Yeah, I love to bring in some sins and ballads, some disability [00:41:00] justice, like, yo, society is only built for a limited range of minds and bodies. And, you know, this is not about your illness. Right. Like if, if we, if our access needs were just met, right. Like disability doesn't exist in the same way.
It doesn't mean that you don't have an impairment, but like, if I think about back to like, at the height of the pandemic, when. You know, overnight, everything switched to Zoom. I was in grad school at that time, and because my access needs were just met, like, that was a choice whether to exclu excuse me, disclose disability.
I didn't have to because I could work from home. There was flexibility around, like, assignments being turned in, contract grading, all these accommodations that were being offered because of the collective trauma we were all living in. Um, you know, and I think [00:42:00] it can be really humanizing to be able to point to something and say like, you know, that actually sounds like you're internalized ableism showing up, like this doesn't sound like a deficit in you.
This doesn't sound like a problem with you. This sounds like some stuff you've internalized. I
Samantha Allweiss LCSW: agree.
Destiny Davis LPC CRC: I also found such a breath of fresh air when all of the COVID lockdowns were happening. Um, and I know that that's a tricky thing to talk about out loud, but yeah, like not having to drive, not having to, I ended up getting a job in person during the pandemic and driving 35 minutes across.
Atlanta, Atlanta traffic is, is just horrible. Um, but there was no traffic. And I was, and I remember, I remember thinking like, what happened? Like I used to have such anxiety driving. What happened to my anxiety? Like, this is amazing. I can drive 35 minutes, no problem. And then the world [00:43:00] started coming back and I was like, Oh, right, right.
It's still here. Um, it's just, I was accommodated during that time. Um, so yeah, it, I, I think that COVID in a lot of ways. Yeah, there, there's a whole tangent I could go on about like what the new norm is after it was a lot of people are trying to go back to old norms, but there is this new norm. And then there's a lot of rigidity that's happening around.
Oh, like customers accepted that we just said no during the pandemic so we can just keep saying no now and that's kind of something that's being that's happening as we're trying to go back. I'm wondering if you, if you either you can speak to this idea of like. Trying to go back to something after everything has changed, because I think that that's what a lot of my clients try to do after they get their diagnosis.
I know I certainly did too. Like we're trying to go back to something, but This new stuff is all [00:44:00] here, whether we look at it or don't.
Samantha Allweiss LCSW: Yeah, you know, I tend to gently press into this over time because what I hear there is an avoidance of the experience of grief.
And it makes so much sense. Again, grief is connected to sadness and it can feel really uncomfy and we tend to want to get away from it. What I tend to do is talk about their experiences of loss and grief and how they've been socialized within their family or society to experience that grief or loss. I do some psychoeducation around the concepts of ambiguous loss and how we don't have customs for honoring these type of losses.
And so they can honestly feel the hardest to sit with. I think going back to our conversation before our group work [00:45:00] can be so powerful because you're sitting with folks who are also experience ambiguous. And loss. And so you're validated around that experience, um, and how there isn't a trajectory for it.
Um, and I love to sit to in the The knowledge that kind of challenging the idea that disability means a deficit and exploring into what have they learned holding the both and so not engaging in toxic positivity around this. But what have they learned, what have they gained access to it has it's been community or other folks that they've connected with a lot of my.
My folks turn to online spaces for sources of friendship and connection because it is more accessible. Some of my folks, especially in both the queer and chronically ill community, have developed, [00:46:00] um, an acute sense of social justice as a result of what they're witnessing and attacks on their community or a lack of acknowledgement on their community.
And it's so beautiful to see. I talk a lot about spirituality. As being like that at the core, it's a connection to something bigger than yourself and how when we move through grief, we also open up and get access to something even bigger and even greater potentially. And that's something that both like instills the hope and, and holds that both and the dialectic of it.
Yeah. What are your thoughts, Nikki?
Niki Colon, LSW: You know, you, you kind of touched on them where my head went initially was grief as well, um, how have folks grieved the loss of the, the old you, the former self, um, you know, we actually just in, in my newer group [00:47:00] that I'm running, we just have this conversation around grief and I posed that question, how have you grieved the loss of the old you and It was silent and I gave it some time because you know the group is still kind of like forming and norming So I was like, you know, maybe maybe you know Maybe this is vulnerable but like, you know time stretched on into eternity and I was like and so I named I was like you know, I'm getting the sense from these crickets here that like maybe folks haven't And then people started talking.
No, I haven't grieved the loss of my old me. I'm not ready to do that yet. Like, maybe I'm still in the denial stage. Um, and so I think part of it is just also honoring that, like, you're talking a lot about how obviously the grieving process is not linear, but I don't know if there's science on this, but it feels to me like The process is long.
The process is long with [00:48:00] disability and really normalizing that, um, normalizing every stage of the process. I wish I could remember who wrote this article, so I apologize for not being able to give credit where credit's due. But I stumbled across an article, it was something along the lines of like, the sixth stage of grief.
Meaning making and I love that I had a whole like session group session just on that. How do we make meaning from this experience? What is legacy and contribution look like? Like, you know, how does helping others contribute to your sense of meaning? Like just mindset shifts, things like that. Um. But it's a process.
I've got to say, like, my longer running group that's been running for about a year, we just did radical acceptance. Like, a year in. That, that's [00:49:00] how long it took before I felt like folks would be ready to receive this. I
Samantha Allweiss LCSW: have one more thought connected to that. I tend to find that folks have idealized their prior self, but when we explore into that, we find that their prior self likely was engaged in hyper productivity and the components of internalized capitalism led them to believe that what they created through work, what they could produce was their meaning, worth and value and how when we are no longer able to.
And actually. forces us to expand our identity. Some, a lot of us have to take time off from work. And I remember when I did how disoriented that was because I realized even as I was talking about these things that I didn't really know who I was without that. And so I had to expand and breathe into that in a really powerful and profound way.
And so for a lot of my folks, [00:50:00] the shifting relationship with work becomes something that is a result of their chronic illness. And then, oh, it gives so much opportunity for self understanding and self love. And so that part's really cool. I think a lot. About care work dreaming disability justice. That's a resource that I share a lot, and we'll make sure to destiny to share the resources that we're talking about so folks can take a look at them, but it's also understanding that.
Someone with a disability has so much to offer, obviously, and shifting that narrative, oh, this is a person that needs care, to bidirectional caregiving in the knowledge and wisdom and understanding that folks with disability have innately, having had to navigate these systems to everything else that they already understand, that our worth is not just what we create.
And I love [00:51:00] to ask the question because similarly it is crickets, but it tends to be so powerful. What if you were enough just as you were? I love to talk with folks about like this idea, like how wild would it be if we really thought that a squirrel every day when they woke up, they got out of their little like tree and they were like, Oh, I have to connect.
I have to collect 30 nuts. in order to be able to sleep in this tree tonight. Otherwise, my family's not going to love me. Otherwise, no one's going to respect me. I have to collect these nuts. We are the only beings on the planet that have to justify our existence through our productivity and really interrogating what, what, what do we want to do with that?
Destiny Davis LPC CRC: That is a phenomenal analogy. That is so good, especially because what came to mind was There are seasons and times where that squirrel does have to grind for their survival, and that is [00:52:00] totally fine, but we don't have to grind 24 7, all day, every day. They're not, they're not squirreling away their nuts because they're, um, trying to prove their worth.
They're squirreling it away to eat throughout the winter and that's it. So once that's done, then they're done. There's nothing more to prove. what else comes to mind around, um, we were really talking about again, feeling seen, feeling heard. And I, I know, I know we talk about this. I talk about this almost every episode, but it's, there's so much to talk. There's so many pieces here. I heard us talking about strengths based. And so it's strengths based, um, like.
Theory acceptance work, um, attachment work, which we've kind of like, I haven't talked a whole lot about, but as we've through here as well, because just feeling seen, feeling heard, like that only works in the presence of someone that you're safely.
Attached [00:53:00] to, and that's why therapy can take so long. I think sometimes I get really caught up in like, if things are taking long, you know, maybe I'm not doing a good enough job. But then I remember how many different pieces are here and everyone's in a different place and needs different things.
And then for their, even for their nervous system to trust what it is we are offering can take time in and of itself. And that's why, that's why this stuff takes so long sometimes.
Samantha Allweiss LCSW: Absolutely. And one thing I think a lot about, you know, for folks who are listening and clinicians who are able body or maybe not experiencing chronic pain or chronic illness is the importance of naming that in the therapeutic space.
I've heard a lot from clients who I've started working with after they've transitioned to another therapist just said, you know, I had named it in the beginning, but it never came up again. in the therapeutic space. We talk a lot about other realms [00:54:00] that you can experience trauma and the medical setting is something that is so rife with that, especially when we're talking with about folks with intersectional identities and the capacity really for your identity to be ignored.
I've had clients who are misgendered in a medical setting and don't feel like they have the space because it is so hierarchical to say, Hey, that's not. That's not those aren't my pronouns or to be denied medical care being told that they need to lose weight when the source of their disability also prevents them from movement that then they're being told that they have to do in order.
to get this treatment that really could profoundly change their life. Like that connection between weight and health is so profoundly and inextricably linked for many providers in a way that actually prevents access to care. And those pieces, again, [00:55:00] because they're ongoing and the trauma doesn't just stop.
It's generally not just one time with one provider. It also speaks to why therapeutic work can take So long or having a space where you have this corrective experience to your point when you're working with a provider that might be invalidating this aspect of you and then being able to go into the therapeutic space and not just have it acknowledged, but have it celebrated that corrective experience becomes really important for combating other systems of oppression.
It's not the only way. But I find with my my spoonie is my chronically ill folks. that that becomes such an important, uh, aspect of our care.
Absolutely.
Niki Colon, LSW: Yes. Yeah. Sorry. Um, thinking a lot too, just about the agency that clients have to assess for disability [00:56:00] affirming clinicians. Uh, the questions. That, that we are allowed to ask, right? Like we're allowed to ask, how familiar are you with medical trauma? We're allowed to ask. You know, can you talk to me about your experience working with disabled people?
Um, you know, how do you incorporate a disability affirming lens into your therapeutic approach? I think a really telling one would be to ask, like, how COVID conscious are you? What COVID precautions, if any, are you taking? Right? Like, That can suss out if, you know, you're in the presence of somebody who believes COVID is over, which obviously is gonna be really harmful to someone who's immunocompromised.
Um, you know, if you have an intersectional identity, like, how do you address the intersection of queer and disabled identities, right? Like, what is your understanding of disability justice [00:57:00] or internalized ableism or medical gaslighting, right? Like, We can ask these questions, and if, if your potential provider cannot answer them, like, that, that's a pretty good indicator that like, this is probably not the person for you.
Destiny Davis LPC CRC: Yeah, I think, you know, to that point, um, you know, when you have your consult call with a therapist. Yes, we ask these questions and we're, you know, there is no, there's no like one right answer. It's more about the answer that resonates with you and, and also remembering it does take time to build trust, but you definitely shouldn't feel like.
There's red flags, like you might not get the 100 percent green flag all the time, simply because the therapist might not know exactly why you're asking this or what you're, not why, but like, um, I've had some questions on consult calls where I'm like, I can tell you're trying to assess something out, but I can't exactly tell, like, so let's [00:58:00] get to know each other and I, we can come back to this question again, but it shouldn't be like a, Okay.
Defensiveness or it shouldn't be like, um, a flat out, like, well, what do you mean COVID's over or whatever, you know, it shouldn't be like a big red flag. Um, yeah. And it's hard because like the population that we're working with has experienced so much medical gaslighting and trauma with their providers.
And so there is a bit of like, uh, there can be like a, I need to make sure this person is right for me before we get started, which is fair because. We don't need any more trauma. And also sometimes it just. I want to just like make sure people know it does still sometimes take time to figure out if your therapist is right for you or not, but it shouldn't like, you shouldn't be leaving each session feeling like, man, I really didn't like this.
Feel I feel this way. I feel bad, but let me give it more time. Let me get more time. Like, it's very tricky. It's tricky.
Samantha Allweiss LCSW: [00:59:00] Yeah, absolutely. And I. I think as therapists on the other side, we need more folks who are skilled at working within these populations. And so it is on us to seek education and we can do that, right?
Like it is also okay to recognize where we still have areas of growth. And there are so many resources out there, and it doesn t just have to be that you ve had a parallel experience. And sometimes folks want folks who have not had that experience, right? And you don t have to be for everyone, but you can also grow in this.
And I ve grown so much in my language and how I talk about this, both through trainings, but also Through clinical work, and I kind of happened and started working with folks who had chronic illness and chronic pain when I was working in refugee resettlement with [01:00:00] folks who had experienced horrific trauma.
And then in my own trajectory, I started experiencing chronic pain and chronic illness. And so it doesn't have to be that you have a parallel experience. And there's so much wealth and wisdom out there in the world that you can get. Even still, and I think like that's an important piece that we're not saying like you can't do if you don't yet know everything and I have folks that I work with who have diagnoses that I wasn't familiar with.
I go and I educate myself to the greatest extent possible, while also sitting in the uniqueness of their experience, so they're not always having to tell me. And this is something I learned in refugee resettlement work, too, of like, trying to understand the context from which people were forcibly displaced, so they're not trying to, they're not having to educate me every single session, keeping up with what is going on in the country of origin of the [01:01:00] folks I work with, so they're not having to tell me when something big happens.
It is also about continuing our education, understanding best practices, um, And growing so that we can do this work, but it doesn't have to be perfect.
Niki Colon, LSW: Yeah, and I think we've talked a lot about how it can be an asset to have shared identity and to have parallel process, but I also think it can be really healing.
The other way around to to actually work with an able bodied therapist who has actually done the work who can provide like a radical healing experience, maybe for the first time ever out of out of a person's out of all of their providers like that can instill hope that can be really healing to actually have that experience.
Um, so I do think that there's, there's a lot. Um, words, help me out, Samantha, um, of [01:02:00] richness gained. Yeah.
Destiny Davis LPC CRC: Yeah. To what you're saying is, um, you know, to have somebody who doesn't have a chronic illness and they can attune to you or keep up with understanding what's happening in the chronic pain world to, to as much as they can.
Um, yeah, because other people in your life who don't understand you often. Typically don't have your experience. And then you just think like, well, you can only understand if you've been in my body, which to a certain extent is, you know, I can only, only you can understand your experience, but then to that point is like the person, the therapist who's chronically ill also can't.
They can understand their experience. They can understand what it's like to live with a chronic illness. And then you can easily be like, Oh, well you only understand because you have a chronic illness. But to be attuned to by someone who doesn't have that same lived experience is so healing.
And I do, for people listening, both therapists and [01:03:00] non therapists, There is now a directory on the website. Y'all are welcome to join it. And if you're looking for a therapist who has lived experience or just has specialty in this area, you can go to the chronicillnesstherapist.
com slash directory and find somebody, find somebody there.
Samantha Allweiss LCSW: Awesome. Yeah. And I don't think that we specified where our practice is located, . We are both licensed in Illinois and our practice is located in Chicago in the loop. So for folks in the area. We do have clinicians that work, uh, do in person work.
A lot of us do virtual and or hybrid work as well. And the same with our yoga studio. And I don't know if Nikki wants to put in a plug for the groups that they're doing, but that maybe could be a helpful resource as well.
Niki Colon, LSW: Yeah, absolutely. So I run two sections of my Spoonies Unite support space. One is on Wednesdays from 530 [01:04:00] to 645.
And the other is on Fridays from 4 o'clock to 5. 15, both virtual and open to anyone in the state of Illinois. So, if you're listening and you're in Illinois and this could be a benefit for you, um, you can find me through our website at, uh, Room2BreatheChicago. com. Is that what it is? Exactly, yeah.
Room2BreatheChicago. com. Uh, and I'm Nikki, N I K I, at Room2BreatheChicago. com. Um, yeah, and if enough of you reach out to me, maybe I'll be forced to start a third group. So, you know, just reach out.
Destiny Davis LPC CRC: Yes. Yeah. Any last words that you want to share or kind of leave people with today as we end?
Samantha Allweiss LCSW: That's a really good question.
One of the resources that has been really healing for me, is Andrea Gibson's work there, an incredibly talented poet. And they have had chronic mental health concerns. They [01:05:00] have chronic illness, ostensibly a terminal illness that they're contending with.
And the way that they write about this duality of both the grief and the beauty and the hope and freedom and the loss and the pain. Having someone share that through art. is incredibly powerful. Like I always say therapy is one therapeutic tool, but there are so many others and art is such a powerful form of healing and being witnessed in that way.
I found myself coming back to Andrea's work. a lot in the group that I was doing, and it provided so much richness and conversation and reflection. So both for folks who are looking for therapeutic, um, resources on their own, or for folks who are wanting to share this with their clients, [01:06:00] their work is.
It's just so powerful.
Niki Colon, LSW: A resource that's been really helpful for me is, uh, the book, The Invisible Kingdom Reimagining Chronic Illness by Megan O'Rourke. I think she does such a fascinating job, uh, really humanizing these really poorly understood autoimmune conditions, um, of which she has several. She talks a lot about long COVID.
And so I think anybody navigating. Something that's poorly understood, I think, could get a lot of benefit from, from this book that is just really deeply humanizing.
Destiny Davis LPC CRC: Amazing. Those sound like really great resources. So thank you for sharing them. I will definitely link them in the show notes below. And yeah, people can find you at RoomToBreatheChicago.
com, um, if they are living in the state of Illinois. And thank you both so much for your time today. so
Samantha Allweiss LCSW: much, Jess.
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Listen to the interview with Samantha, Niki, and me, Destiny, on Episode 78 of The Chronic Illness Therapist Podcast.
Samantha Allweiss, LCSW, brings extensive expertise in Social Welfare and Gender and Women's Studies, along with specialized training in Psychologically-Informed Yoga and Hanna Somatics. With over eight years of experience serving refugees and immigrant populations through culturally responsive clinical services, she specializes in supporting trauma survivors and individuals experiencing mood-related challenges.
Niki Colon, LCSW, approaches therapy through an anti-oppressive, trauma-informed, and compassion-focused lens, emphasizing harm reduction while centering each individual's unique context, values, and strengths. Her clinical experience is rooted in Contextual Behavioral Science, particularly Acceptance and Commitment Therapy (ACT), and Internal Family Systems (IFS).
Meet Destiny - The host of The Chronic Illness Therapist Podcast and a licensed mental health therapist in the states of Georgia and Florida. Destiny offers traditional 50-minute therapy sessions as well as therapy intensives and monthly online workshops for the chronic illness community.
Destiny Davis, LPC CRC, is solely responsible for the content of this document. The views expressed herein may or may not necessarily reflect the opinions of Samantha Allweiss and Niki Colon.